What is justification by faith? Should we speak in tongues? 🤔 Ask NT Wright Anything

Best podcast ever.

Great conversation! I origin from a slightly different theological camp, but your conversations with Tom are always stimulating my thinking in many areas.

Praise God. Tears of joy that there is an N T Wright among us.

Justification is a multifaceted blessing, some present, some furniture.

Want to know about justification? Hear " Justification from eternity." By bill mcdaniel. And then there is another 2 sermons by jim casey On the same glorious doctrine.

7:09 - “That ain’t necessarily so”—a great sound bite 😊

Paul and the rest of the early church had a strong sense of the difference between what is possible in this age and the perfection of the age to come. They understood the temptation to seek power in this age, which could become a terribly corrupting force. On the other hand, they also understood Jesus' command to be light and salt to others, through good works, that others might give glory to our Father in heaven. Every generation of the church community must walk that tightrope.

I believe that so many people don't seem to understand tongues but the purpose of tongues was to speak to people in their own languages say for instance I speak English only but if I needed to speak to someone that speaks only German or whatever I would be able to communicate with them! Read Acts.

Amen❤

Justified by pistis. Justified by loyal allegiance?

Would be helpful to compare justification by faith with the usual justification by law.

I'm confused by the election answer. :(

Romans 5:12, which reads: “By one man sin entered the world, and death by sin; so death passed upon all men, for in him all men sinned.” Augustine repeatedly referred to this verse and thought it plain and unambiguous. The problem is that the Latin translation renders the Greek phrase eph’ ho as “in him”, which is an impossible rendering. Sanday and Headlam, one of the great modern textual authorities on Romans, wrote: “Though this expression (eph’ ho) has been much fought over, there can now be little doubt that the true rendering is “because.” ”Thus “death spread to all men, because all sinned”.

Wright offers a strange and novel definition of justification in its peculiar narrowness. After all, Abraham wasn't in Galatia or Rome nor was he justified as a Jew nor Gentile in a reconciliatory community with others. Clearly, he was justified in no other way than through his living faith in God that came entirely by grace. Moreover, we find the same to be true of all saints prior to the New Testament era. Then, it was applied partially as Wright explains, but also with the whole of salvation history in view. But let's hear from the earliest Roman church leader known outside the New Testament.... Clement of Rome: “Whosoever will candidly consider each particular, will recognize the greatness of the gifts which were given by him. For from him have sprung the priests and all the Levites who minister at the altar of God. From him also [was descended] our Lord Jesus Christ according to the flesh. From him [arose] kings, princes, and rulers of the race of Judah. Nor are his other tribes in small glory, inasmuch as God had promised, “Thy seed shall be as the stars of heaven.” All these, therefore, were highly honored, and made great, not for their own sake, or for their own works, or for the righteousness which they wrought, but through the operation of His will. And we, too, being called by His will in Christ Jesus, are not justified by ourselves, nor by our own wisdom, or understanding, or godliness, or works which we have wrought in holiness of heart; but by that faith through which, from the beginning, Almighty God has justified all men; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen. ANF: Vol. I, The Apostolic Fathers, First Epistle of Clement to the Corinthians, Chapter 32.

Oof. That opening remark about the cultural definitions of theological words that have been "cut loose" from their original context in the Bible. Then people start with their isolated notional re-definition, and work backward, imposing that idea over the Biblical text which originally meant something drastically different from their misinformed construct. Yikes. YES. This is exactly how we get stuck with these intractable historical denominational disagreements, with (at least one, or sometimes both) sides simplistically relying on badly-twisted proof-texts, while calling each other heretics. I'm gonna refrain from "naming names" here. But it is exactly this issue, that makes Bishop Wright seem to me so much more credible, than some of his vitriolic critics.

Right on brother

Faith (Pistis) in the "invisible" God encompasses the entire cognitive/intellectual acknowledge of the truth by a firm personal submissive surrender/conviction with dynamic/ continuous conduct "until death". While Grace (Charis) is a free gift from the Father (2 cor. 1:12) and Christ (Gal.1:6). those that choose not to accept this great gift or those that accepted but "backslide", fall away, forsake or defect (Apostasia) will be disinherited. Gentiles grafted to the olive tree as xenograft are Abraham's adopted heirs while "remnants" of the Israelites grafted to its native branch, if both bare no fruit shamed the Holy Spirit will only be good for fire.

Should one believe first or should they get three degrees, fill up a nice library, join the debate club, abandon reason and logic, disprove all other belief systems, etc. etc,…..first?

Wright and his New Perspective ignore the great practical question of, "Are my sins forgiven? How are my sins forgiven?" and reduces it down to just covenantal membership. By all means, argue that the familial and covenantal aspects of justification were neglected by the Reformers / in Protestantism, but you're throwing the baby out with the bathwater. It's doing huge damage. And TBH, if you must pick one aspect then the one the Reformers would choose is better than that which Wright would choose.

Intresting claims now Provide the evidence to backup your claims. Providing faith is like going in circles of claims without any external demonstrable justification and verification which is oxymoronic!