Tom Bombadil & Sauron: Did They Know Each Other? | Lord of the Rings Lore

If you had to pick a favourite character out of the two, are you TeamTom? Or TeamSauron? 😁

I always felt like Tom Bombadill was the music that was being sung at the time of creation.

Much of Tolkien’s writings is manifest from his Catholic background and theology. Coming from this background myself, I believe Tom is included as a reference and contrast only… in the manner of saying you don’t know how dark something is until you have seen the light, we need Tom to show us the importance of other things by comparing them to himself. Biblically there is a brief appearance of a man named Melchizedek (Genesis 14). We’re only told that he had no beginning and no end and he was a “priest of God” literally hundreds of years before the priesthood was established. Who was he? How was he a priest? he just was. Later in the New Testament, Jesus is described as a “priest of the order of Melchizedek”, meaning he had no beginning, no end, he simply exists forever as a priest between man and God. The only reason Melchizedek is included is so he can help us understand something else by comparison. The similarities between Melchizedek and Tom are too close to be coincidence for a writer like JRRT, I’m surprised there isn’t more mention of this correlation.

Tom may have met Sauron but he probably forgot that he did

The chapter about the hobbits‘ visit with Bombadil mentions that they find him surprisingly knowledgeable about the goings-on of the wider world — he knows much about their families, and evidently has had dealings with Elves. He‘s very curious in their conversations, and the hobbits eventually get so comfortable, and his questions are so “cunning“, that they start revealing more about their secrets than they‘d expected. And then the briefest of hints from Tolkien — “there was a glint in his eyes when he heard of the Riders“, meaning the Black Riders, all that the hobbits knew of the Nazgûl at the time. Tolkien reveals only a little, but I think the message is clear that Tom is very much aware of the world around him, including the Nazgûl, presumably Sauron as well.

My guess is that Sauron would pay him little mind. He was certainly aware of him. He had servants placed within Tom's realm by his own lieutenant (the barrow wights were sent there by the witch king). I don't think he'd see Tom as a threat though, at least not one of the more pressing ones. I think that, if Sauron were to accomplish his goal of total domination, Tom would simply leave and return to wherever he came from rather than lingering in a middle earth that no longer suited his carefree existence.

The way you are able to turn our ideas and scripts into an emotional throughline and lend the moments of pathos and beauty with a voice which is truly kind. Thanks for continuing to share Professor Tolkien's lessons to readers, fans of film and of letters. This man is the kindliest bossman on the internet and the second nicest in the UK. Get 'em James!

I've always seen Tom as something like Ungoliant. An embodiment as Ungoiant was an embodiment of the void. And saying he's fartherless to me means he was inadvertently created when the living world was created. He was an embodiment that came into being at the same time as the world itself. And as long as something living exists so will he. Which is why he is the first and the last.

a term to describe Tom is a Genus Loci; a conciousness that was spawned from all of nature itself

Good Morning! As soon as I saw the title for this I got excited. This is a fascinating subject. Some facts and questions that occur to me before I even begin watching this are, firstly Tom Bombadil put on the ring and it did not turn him invisible. Sauron, a Maia, does not turn invisible when wearing his ring. He was never described as being invisible when he wore the ring in the Battle of the Last Alliance, Gil-Galad and Elendil saw him plainly to engage and battle, and his fallen body was visible after his defeat and Isuldur did not need to seek his remains out to find and cut off the finger wearing the ring. From this, it can be inferred that the ring would not confer invisibility had it been put on by either Gandalf or Saruman. It also bears out that Tom Bombadil is an immortal and spiritual being, of at least Maia power level. However the final word of canon remains in Tolkien's published letters on the subject. He has clearly stated that "In all works of literature there must be enigmas, things even the author does not know" I didn't research the verbatim comment, but this is it in essence. It will never be for us as readers to truly know the nature of Tom Bombadil. He is to be guessed at, thought and speculated about, but that is about it. Now I am going to pour myself a cup of coffee and enjoy the video :)

There is a theory i love. Music is so strong in tolkiens lore. If luthien could waltz into morgoths chambers and put them all to sleep, i think the same happens with a bombadil sauron fight. Tom comes skipping out and sings a Song that puts sauron to sleep forever and buries sauron and goes skipping on his merry way.

Tom represents self-mastery while Sauron represents the ability to control and dominate others. So I doubt there would ever be a scenario in which Tom and Sauron confronted one another - it is Sauron's nature to hide behind his pawns. But if they DID meet, I believe they'd be pretty evenly matched. Which is why Sauron would never allow that kind of confrontation to occur.

I think it's possible that Sauron never noticed Tom, just as he never noticed the hobbits. Tom doesn't have enough ambition, isn't concerned enough with domination and conquest, to come onto Sauron's radar. His territory would just seem to him elvish or something like that. He probably wouldn't be inclined to go there, since it's unknown and has nothing to offer that is valuable to him. It's not as if Tom would go out of his way to make Sauron's acquaintance.

I've often thought that Tom Bombadil and Goldberry represent a type of manifestation of "Father Time" and "Mother Nature" Bombadil may have been an inevitable creation brought into existence upon the invention of the world. His power is passive, the One Ring does not affect him because time will oulast everything. Sauron is imortal, but The One Ring is not... If for no other reason than it is a tangible, artifact of the physical world. If Bombadil is Father Time, it explains why he is unconcerned about power, domination and victory. By his very nature, he understands these things are fleeting and therefore unimportant.

He seems like the same kind of creature as Ungoliant and the thing in lake. Maybe outside entities not created by illuvatar.

I wish there was actual writing showing how these two would compare to each other if they had met as rivals.

I’m almost 100% sure with Tolkiens religious background that Tom Bombadil is actually Eru Illuvitar in a bodily form. It would explain his why he’s unaffected by the ring, he chooses to stay in a “garden of Eden” and he doesn’t intervene unless absolutely necessary like the sinking of Numenor and giving Gollum a little shove into Mt.Doom. He says he fatherless. The only possible type of being it could be would be Eru Illuvitar.

I always thought of Tom Bombadil as “eldest and fatherless” meaning he is a part of Eru. A small portion of him put in place in his creation. Just my thoughts

Nice work dude thanks

Sauron didn’t know about the shire I’m not sure if he would know about Tommy B