Did John Ever Actually Betray Dutch?

Short version…not really. What do you think?

No John like Arthur, never betrayed Dutch. It was Dutch's ego, and willingly allowing Micah to manipulate him by acting as a yes man, that things became so bad. Even if that weren't the case, you have Hosea who knew what Dutch was like and challenged him on his decisions.

It's exactly like Sadie said: The Dutch who put a blanket on me after the O'Driscolls wasn't the same Dutch from Beaver Hollow

John was betrayed by Dutch twice and he stayed in the gang because he didn't have anything else to go or because he didn't want to leave Arthur alone

I believe one of the best scenes in the game is how furious John was with Dutch: “You left me!!” Poor guy felt so betrayed and the voice actor nailed that line. The love of money 💵 💰 destroys all. Plus Dutch is blind because I put so much cash in that blasted box but nooooo: “good job Arthur but we need more money!!”

No, Dutch's ego just didn't allow him to move on. If Hosea, Lenny, and Sean (if he actually saw through him) survived, Dutch would have taken any opportunity to leave them behind as well. Hosea wasn't perfect but he tried. Lenny and Hosea both saw through Dutch for a while. Eventually, Arthur and John too. Heidi McCourt did as well. Dutch never changed.

What if Dutch shot Micah not because of this shame about Arthur's death but because he realized that Arthur words that Micah was a rat made a lot of sense when he looked at it and Micah would probaly sell out Dutch like he did to the gang 8 years earlier

John was like Arthur. You can see it in St Denis. 'Never should'a gonna gone after Bronte Dutch!' John never actually betrayed him, he did what needed to be done just like Arthur did. But he saw the truth

Dutch betrayed Dutch by turning on the Arthur and John and Charles. The ones who actually tried to save the gang from going head first into a car wreck.

dutch started it like john said in american venom

John still respected Dutch for raising him. He still had painful memories of him though which is why he was so conflicted. With Bill and Javier, he was also very conflicted and tried to peacefully capture them despite his commitment to his family, but with Dutch it was far more complex, especially considering how Dutch saved John from Micah and allowed him to fulfil one of John’s biggest goals - killing the man who betrayed the gang and do right by Arthur as Arthur would’ve also hunted Micah down if he lived, but he would discourage John from doing so himself.

john was acting strange around Dutch because he saw his change

Something thats just come to me watching John coming back to camp is Bill's confused "John?" Bill would have followed Dutch to the end until this, i think this is what turned Bill into who he is in RDR, it broke him completely knowing the man who put his hope and trust into can betray one of his own "sons." He eventually realised that to Dutch he was just a tool and a servant just like John and Arthur, and like them Dutch would sacrifice him if he even sensed disloyalty(real or not). In a way Arthur's sacrifice saved Bill and Javier from Dutch's influence but they couldnt leave the life of crime behind.

1:47 Pause here, a fuckin' bird falls out of the sky

The short answer is no. John didn't betray Dutch, Dutch betrayed both him and Arthur.

14:26 I had a GODDAMN PLAN! Shakes eagle flies hand

no way i've finished ghost of tsushima about 1 month ago and just ended read dead 2 and you consistently provide awesome content for both, great channel discovery thx

Can u do a vid on what if jack marston got shipped to italy instead of going to bronte

Dutch recognized the error in his ways when shot Micah. But look at how he looked at john afterwards. If wasn't for ross, marston would've left Dutch alone.

John didn’t betray Dutch, Dutch betrayed John