The Doom of the Elves Explained

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Published 2023-11-29
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All Comments (21)
  • @NathanWeeks
    I think Tolkien, being an older man who had lived through two world wars and rapid industrialization, viewed the idea of immortality as more of a curse. There were likely times he envied people who had died before witnessing what he had seen.
  • @audgusto
    As Elrond once told Neo, “we are not here because we are free, we are here because we are not free.”
  • @genlob
    Dwindle to a rustic folk of dell and cave, slowly to forget and to be forgotten. Also the fate of the Tuatha de Danaan; magical beings from Irish myth, who faded to become the fairy folk, the mound dwelling Sidhe, following the arrival of humans. They also originally came out of the west.
  • @anni.68
    It's funny that Galadriel told a Hobbit - of all people - that the Elves of Middle-earth will dwindle to a "rustic folk of dell and cave". I am sure that Frodo was very happy to hear her high opinion about his people's' way of life 😀
  • @johnphillips4708
    I get weary of the endless cycles of the world too and I’m only in my 30’s lol. Can’t imagine living for thousands of years, sounds exhausting.
  • @danesorensen1775
    As I understand it, as well, the Eldar's lifespan was that of the world, so when the end comes (as it inevitably will), they too will die. And whether there's anything after that, they don't know, but it doesn't sound like it. I remember one writer in the days of Web 1.0 saying they were like passengers on a sinking ocean liner, wondering why the humans were always trying to get out of the lifeboats and back onto the sinking ship.
  • @striker8961
    "For it is the doom of Men that they forget." - Merlin, Excalibur. Much like the Elves, Merlin grows tired. "There are other worlds Arthur, this one is done with me." But he ends up trapped within the heart of the earth. To forget, and not carry the weariness of the memory of the ages. Arthur was blessed to not know the sins of his father. But so too can as Merlin said forget the good moments, moments to look back on and be proud of. A blessing and a curse.
  • @EmblemParade
    I understand elves as not merely having a doom ("fate" or "destiny") but as being especially bound to their doom, generally bound to the melody of their song. They are fateful people. For example, oaths have an extremely powerful hold on them, and in turn their oaths can change the course of history and the shape of the world. The fact that men do not know their own fate liberates them to choose their own bindings. Do they make the right choices? Are they on the right track? Nobody will know until the great song, time, ends.
  • @ericjensen7580
    Well done! One thing about the word "doom" is Tolkien seems to use it in the old english sense (dōm), which means "judgement" or "law".
  • @demarge1065
    Imagine being an elf sent back after an osha violation related slaying
  • @c.j.nyssen6987
    I think something that also gets missed (especially in the films) is the fact the Elves are, in addition to being long-lived keepers of history and wisdom, also very much creatures of the present moment. Their attitudes in the books when dealing with mortals are merriment and bemusement. They sing nonsense songs in addition to historical ballads, go for star-gazing parties, and feast and drink with the best of them. They are tied to the world and delight in it, with small and grand expressions. It's only when they lose that enjoyment that they decide to go to the Undying Lands, which as Robert pointed out suit their unchanging nature. What I don't like to think about the Doom of Elves, is what happens to them when the world (of which the Undying Lands are still part) meets its doom.
  • @redrackham6812
    For what it's worth, the word "doom" literally means judgment. That is why the day of judgment is called doomsday. Interestingly, Tolkien, philologist that he was, gives his readers a lesson about this during the council of Elrond, when he has Elrond ask "What shall we do with the Ring, the least of rings, the trifle that Sauron fancies? That is the doom that we must deem." Deem, to judge, is simply the verb-form of doom; Elrond is just saying, in effect, 'this is the judgment we must judge.' So the doom of the elves is just the judgment of the elves, i.e., the law or rule that applies to them, and the doom of men is simply the law or rule that applies to men.
  • @sampm86
    So poetic, beautiful and sad, the Elves first awoke in Middle Earth, it is their home also and they love it. And yet, they have to leave it behind at some point or fade.
  • The catch is, no one knows where humans go once they die. Elves and Maiar know exactly where they'll go after centuries/millennia of living, but humans will die after 80 years, many earlier due to illness, and go - god knows where, but we're supposed to be grateful for it anyway?
  • @amasterofone
    I first encountered this idea of doomed immortality when a couple decades ago reading Anne Rice's vampire chronicles. I have to admit as a young person the idea of immortality being a curse was completely lost on me. Learning more about Tolkein's ideas now that I'm in midlife, it makes a lot more sense.
  • This kinda puts a new perspective on Arwen's decision to give up her immortality. On one hand, it's incredibly sad that she will probably never be able to see her father, mother, or brothers again. On the other, it must also feel a bit freeing.
  • @howardroark7726
    Is poor Feanor still languishing in the Halls? If so, he must be yearning for the gift of men. At some point immortality must be like Groundhog Day.
  • @TimGaastra
    One thing else about the dooms, as you mentioned elsewhere, is that Morgoth is in Arda yet, invested in its being, even if his consciousness has been cast into the abyss. So elves have to live with that as long as Arda endures as it does, but the doom of Man is such that Man is pulled free of that when he dies. I.E. allegorically, Man has salvation from corruption before corruption itself is ended. That, more than anything, is probably what the elves envied.
  • If not for the undying lands this would have been cruel and harrowing. It's thoughtful of Tolkein/Eru that the Elves always had a get out clause for when the Earth became unsuitable for them.
  • @ThommyofThenn
    Slowly fading in order to make room for humanity is in some ways a far sadder fate than dying in battle or something. Its also interesting seeing this idea of immortality getting old after a while. A few video games I've played have toyed with this concept to varying degrees. It's nice to become aware of the more subtle Tolkien influences in the wider fantasy canon